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Report 1366
Report #1366 Skillset: Ecology Skill: Familiar Org: Harbingers Status: Completed Apr 2016 Furies' Decision: Solution 1. Problem: Ecology as a whole is a skillset that is still stuck behind the times. This report aims to fix a small problem, while alternatively suggesting a solution to upgade the skillset and Familiars in general. 0 R: 0 Solution #1: Ordering your bond to sting takes 3 power every time, you should never order it passive. Simply allow the Ecologist to pacify and re-order to kill without using 3 power until the 10 attacks have been used. Or at least change the skill description so curious George doesn't have to waste power to figure out if it actually works that way. 0 R: 0 Solution #2: The familiar attacks stupidly fast at 4 seconds for 3 power, plus Snakebonding a snake to give another affliction is actually really strong. It's a better version of Angels/Demons without the beckoning/manakilling. With Deafness requiring PurityDust, I could load up 10 applications of paralysis on my Familiar (which is what I will be doing until this changes, with an occasional ibululu) and keep you easily locked down in a room between blanknote, paralysis, p5th and whatever else my passive bard songs can do to you. My proposal is to slow the Familiar down to somewhere between 6 and 12 seconds and adjust the power cost to compensate, while also changing it to attack on command. 0 R: 0 Solution #3: This is the big change suggestion and impacts how Familiars work in general. Right now the Familiar attacks every 12 seconds for 150 damage. Give the Familiar three phases and slightly increase it's attack speed (definitely not as fast as 4 seconds, but not as slow as 12), the first phase is its normal phase, where it does some damage, perhaps breaks shields or something slightly useful, maybe unique to your Familiar. The second phase is the FamiliarSmudge phase, where your Familiar can hold multiple smudges and deliver a smudge in the same room as you, instead of how that skill works now. The final stage is the FamiliarSting phase, where it delivers poison and the Snakebond goes in use. Make the 3 power cost the cost to switch between Familiar phases, and the familiar will keep attacking with that phase until you change phases. And finally, for FamiliarBerserk, instead of making it attack faster for 6 power, slightly lower the power cost. maybe to 2-5 power but have all three Phases going at once for 3-10 attacks. This solution would require changes to 4 skills (Rebirth, FamiliarSmudge, FamiliarSting, and FamiliarBerserk) but I believe it would fix a few issues now and prevent issues when the overhaul is eventually finished. Player Comments: ---on 4/4 @ 08:15 writes: Open to anything. I think the speed and the power cost needs to be adjusted, and I am sure the skill will also have an impact on FamiliarBerserk, which the power cost of that skill is too high to be any useful right now and will be getting a report of its own probably soon. If poison shrugging is to go out the window, a lot of Ecologist complaints would go away and some problems would come up with this skill. ---on 4/5 @ 08:15 writes: I am personally inclined toward solution 3 - full reworks that drop outdated and possibly abusable mechanics in return for a re-balanced, strategical and fun mechanic is always a good idea. Regarding the numbers, I'm not sure if 1 poison ever 4s is too much, but I've never been an ecologist with SnakeBond before. I think 6s is a good compromise. Maybe different attack timings for the different phases - 6s passive shield break may be too fast, and a 10s smudge might be too slow (?). Damage of the normal attacks should probably hover around 300 per 10s or so? I think that's a number which will be okay with the archetypes that have access to eco (druids and commune bards) without being overpowering with their other passives. Regarding the phases, I would suggest making it possible to specify which phase you want it to be directly (poison phase, or smudge phase) without having to go through a sequence, but make it last only 5 minutes before defaulting back to the normal phase. Similarly for berserk, could make it 5p to last for 30s or 1min, instead of a set number of attacks, especially if you decide to differentiate the attack times for the different phases. ---on 4/6 @ 03:48 writes: All good suggestions, I didn't want to suggest different times for the different phases to not put too much pressure on coders. The breaking shields was just a suggestion for a starting point, I do not think it's actually that necessary (but could be pretty impactful for a skillset that is hurting). If you want creative, I can definitely come up with a unique attack for every Familiar that you can have. I think the Familiar's bonuses themselves will need looking at. My goal with this report is to offer a baseline to build on towards Ecology, I am not particular on any numbers, and would definitely like Druids input in this because I've rarely met an Ecologist. ---on 4/10 @ 23:56 writes: Solution 3 is intriguing, although I'm not sure if I understand the skillset enough to evaluate it properly. I'm definitely for solution 1, that's more of a quality of life thing than a balance thing. For solution 2, I'm not sure if that's actually overpowered but as I mentioned for sol. 3 this could be out of my ignorance. Solution 2 seems fine, when you say change it to attack on command do you mean something like ORDER STING WOBOU or do you mean implementing sol 1? ---on 4/11 @ 05:57 writes: Exactly Wobou for solution 2. Also combine these solutions with the Report that has been submitted since August of last year, Report 1372, which is basically the halfway version of solution 3. ---on 4/13 @ 00:04 writes: I'm happy with solution 1 or 2, however depending on whether shrugging remains or not, the shrug rate at the moment makes the 4 second sting not bad at all, since the chance of shrugging the attack is quite high reducing its and snakebonds effectiveness by quite alot. Also just for the record, you can't envenom a bond with ibululu, however you can use a cobra snakebond. Solution three does sound very interesting, I'm just worried about passive smudges however if this is what you meant. Familiar berserk definitely needs some sort of change as its never been useful imo with its power cost and effects. ---on 4/14 @ 05:39 writes: I do not really want to submit this report because I do not think it will be enough for Ecology, with this report and 1372, I do not think either will be enough. I do prefer solution 3, and the consensus on report 1372 as well, which would make it competitive. If smudges are too much, they can be toned down or adjusted with familiar to compensate, but there have been 5 previous reports on Familiars. The 6th time is the charm. ---on 4/16 @ 04:26 writes: I completely forgot to respond to Asmodea's concerns. I think as long as smudges are limited in the fashion that they are now for an Ecologist, that you can only have one prepared at a time, that having a passive smudger is ok. I would say for balance purposes allow the familiar to hold more than one Smudge at a time, and limit the Ecologist to just the one in their inventory, so they would have to fashion each individual smudge that the familiar uses. Also, Harbingers cause additional poisons and increased dust balance, plus with earache being on dust balance (at the moment), I figured it would be a good time to look at this now before it becomes an issue. ---on 4/17 @ 15:07 writes: Sorry for my delay in response. I can't fully evaluate solution 3 because I don't know much about ecology but it seems like a good change overall. If your response ends up quelling Asmodea's concerns then that's enough for me. I definitely support solution 1 and 2. ---on 4/18 @ 20:54 writes: Solution 1 is fine. Make it so that the power cost is tied to envenoming the familiar, perhaps? No support for solution 2 if the solution is just "dramatically slow down the affliction rate". I think that a better direction would be to explore some kind of mechanic by which the ecologist gets an extra beast-spit-esque mechanic instead of a passive venom application. ---on 4/18 @ 20:57 writes: On solution 3, I think there needs to be some clarification. When you say 'phases', I think you mean 'modes' that the ecologist freely activates or deactivates - in the way that ecologists now pay 3p to turn on familiar stinging mode. In that case, it would make sense to have the different modes be different skills peppered throughout the skillset, one of them replacing the existing (defunct) berserkfamiliar, as you mention. ---on 4/18 @ 20:57 writes: However, I'm not really on board with the proposed modes or tying them to passive bond attacking. Seems to me that the dramatically superior solution would be to give ecologists a bond balance (like a beast balance) and put the kinds of things you mention on that bond balance. This could depreciate the fetish as the sole immediate active ability in the skillset and cleanly introduce a framework for future upgrades and additions to the skillset. ---on 4/22 @ 03:12 writes: I didn't want to suggest giving Familiars their own balance because I have suggested to that to every single ent class so far. I am all for that changed, if that is the way to go, but since it hasn't been done to Angels/Demons yet, I am not sure it will be done for all others. I do think most ent classes should be on their own balance so it isn't set and forget and provides actual strategy and game planning. And I meant phases, yes. Passive smudges may be too strong, perhaps it is and I am open to anything. I just think Ecology could have more than double fetish spamming, and using ArmouredFamiliar (And FamiliarSting/Berserk) are the way to upgrade it.